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[javaee-spec users] [jsr342-experts] Re: Logs. Should we finally do something ?

  • From: Werner Keil <werner.keil@...>
  • To: jsr342-experts@...
  • Subject: [javaee-spec users] [jsr342-experts] Re: Logs. Should we finally do something ?
  • Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2012 11:04:29 +0200
  • List-id: <jsr342-experts.javaee-spec.java.net>

A Giant Leap for JavaKind

(R.I.P. Neil Armstrong, especially since he's been buried at sea just the day our EC Meeting concludes next week)

On Fri, Sep 7, 2012 at 5:22 AM, Markus Eisele <myfear@...> wrote:
Hi Antonio,

thanks for pushing this! I am curious about the outcome. That would be a huge step forward!

- M


On 7 September 2012 00:59, Antonio Goncalves <antonio.goncalves@...> wrote:
Bill, Linda, I have an interesting comment on my blog from Ceki Gülcü : http://antoniogoncalves.org/2012/09/06/i-need-you-for-logging-api-spec-lead/#comment-1468

I don’t think conjuring a successful logging standard is going to be a walk in the park. Do you know if Oracle/Sun would support this JSR?

I don't know if Ceki would be interested to be part or lead such a JSR but he is asking if such an effort would be supported by Oracle. What is your point of view on this ?

Antonio


On Thu, Sep 6, 2012 at 2:08 PM, Antonio Goncalves <antonio.goncalves@...> wrote:
Well, you never know, someone out there might be interested :  http://antoniogoncalves.org/2012/09/06/i-need-you-for-logging-api-spec-lead/ 

Antonio


On Mon, Jul 30, 2012 at 3:32 PM, Werner Keil <werner.keil@...> wrote:
The fact is, Log4J, SLF4J and Logback were all done at least partly by  Ceki Gülcü
I haven't met him personally as I remember we were speaking at different days on events like DevoXX, but I've been in touch with him since investigating a unified logging strategy for several large telcos over the last couple of years, most recently about a year ago in India.

He's based in Switzerland, but I am not sure, if he is JCP Member or interested in this kind of thing. 

If you could get his support or participation in a Logging JSR, this sounds like a great idea, to get things right.
While it almost replicated some JavaEE aspects like JSF Bean Converters (without JSF Context) and has a "light" version of JSR-310 somewhat similar to the Fantom language (which as mentioned also offers modularity)  JavaFX currently has no Logging functionality other than most likely using JDK Logging internally. A neutral and improved Logging JSR could therefore benefit not only EE and App Servers, but also Rich Clients in JavaFX and Mobile Solutions, if Java ever gains enough momentum there again...?

Cheers,
-- 

Werner Keil JCP Executive Committee Member | Eclipse UOMo Lead

Twitter @wernerkeil | #Java_Social | #EclipseUOMo | #OpenDDR

Skype werner.keil | Google+ gplus.to/wernerkeil

* Chip-to-Cloud Security Forum: September 19 2012, Nice, French Riviera. Werner Keil, JCP Executive Committee, JSR-321 EG Member will present "Trusted Computing API for Java™"

* Eclipse Day Delft: September 27 2012, Delft, Netherlands. Werner Keil, Eclipse Committer, UOMo Lead, Mærsk Build Manager will present "Triple-E class Continuous Delivery with Hudson, Maven and Mylyn"

* JavaOne: September 30-October 4 2012, San Francisco, USA. Werner Keil,  JCP Executive Committee will represent "Eclipse UOMo, STEM, and JSRs involved in, e.g. 331 or JCP.next"


On Mon, Jul 30, 2012 at 3:12 PM, Antonio Goncalves <antonio.goncalves@...> wrote:
Hi Markus,

I think everybody agrees that having a standard API for logging is important (and with multi tenant in the way, it would really make sense for Java EE 7). But the problem is "who would be ready to start a new JSR on logging" ? I don't personally know the developers behind JUL, Log4j, SLF4J or Logback... but they would be awesome candidates.

Antonio

On Wed, Jul 18, 2012 at 8:24 AM, Markus Eisele <myfear@...> wrote:
Popping this up again because of the missing feedback from Linda/Bill.

- Markus

On 16 April 2012 19:49, Antonio Goncalves <antonio.goncalves@...> wrote:
> I like the idea of standardizing staging in all the specs (and not just JSF)
> and I also like the idea of using this staging for log levels (instead of
> FINEST, TRACE or whatever). But again, that would mean having a standard way
> accross Java EE to define staging and log levels
>
>
> On Sunday, April 15, 2012, Adam Bien wrote:
>>
>> Hi Antonio,
>>
>> whats about coupling the log settings to "run levels"?
>>
>> Every application server I know comes with "development" and "production"
>> stage.
>>
>> We could rely on the spec packages and use then something like:
>>
>> javax.ejb=production (whatever it means for Log4j -> mapping would be
>> server-specific)
>> javax.rs=development
>> javax.enterprise.inject (but now org.weld)
>>
>> etc.
>>
>> I see a problem with your proposals, that the specifiied log levels do not
>> have to be available for each framework (log4j, java logging, etc.).
>>
>> thoughts?
>>
>> adam
>> On 09.03.2012, at 15:43, Antonio Goncalves wrote:
>>
>> > Hi all,
>> >
>> > We are in 2012 and I just spent a few hours trying to display the logs
>> > of an application on GlassFish 3.1.2 and JBoss 7.1.0 (and it's not the first
>> > time in my career). Modules to exclude in one, jars to add in the
>> > WEB-INF/lib on the other... or to exclude. And of course, that's just my
>> > application Log4j logs. If I want to have more logs on javax.ejb I need to
>> > setup a different file in JBoss and another one in GlassFish.
>> >
>> > I know javax.util.logging exists in Java SE but nobody tends to use it
>> > (despite GlassFish uses it and JBoss has a brand new logger that wraps
>> > java.util.logging), I know we can happily choose from 10 fashionable brand
>> > new logging frameworks... but really, it's a pain. Every application uses
>> > logs. Every framework uses logs. Every Java EE spec implementation uses
>> > logs. For an application to be portable across app servers, for a
>> > configuration file to be portable across Java EE specs, we should do
>> > something.
>> >
>> > I would love to write :
>> >
>> > javax.ejb.level = debug
>> > javax.persistence.level = debug
>> > org.weld.level = debug
>> > my.app.level = debug
>> >
>> > Add this config file under WEB-INF/classes and don't worry about
>> > anything else... and have the same behavior under GlassFish, JBoss or
>> > whatever.
>> >
>> > Logging frameworks have been a battle since day one and it's one of the
>> > things that make me feel the Java ecosystem is too complex and is slowly
>> > fading from developers/ops concerns. Gosh, I just want to display some logs,
>> > why do I have to choose from 10 different frameworks and why should I battle
>> > with app server configuration.
>> >
>> > Isn't it the role of the Java EE spec to make the other spec agree to a
>> > standard ? And what about logging ?
>> >
>> > Antonio
>>
>
>
> --
> Antonio Goncalves
> Software architect and Java Champion
>
> Web site | Twitter | Blog | LinkedIn | Paris JUG



--
Antonio Goncalves
Software architect and Java Champion

Web site | TwitterLinkedInParis JUG | Devoxx France




--
Antonio Goncalves
Software architect and Java Champion

Web site | TwitterLinkedInParis JUG | Devoxx France



--
Antonio Goncalves
Software architect and Java Champion

Web site | TwitterLinkedInParis JUG | Devoxx France




[javaee-spec users] [jsr342-experts] Re: Logs. Should we finally do something ?

Antonio Goncalves 09/06/2012

[javaee-spec users] [jsr342-experts] Re: Logs. Should we finally do something ?

Werner Keil 09/06/2012

[javaee-spec users] [jsr342-experts] Re: Logs. Should we finally do something ?

Werner Keil 09/06/2012

[javaee-spec users] [jsr342-experts] Re: Logs. Should we finally do something ?

Antonio Goncalves 09/06/2012

[javaee-spec users] [jsr342-experts] Re: Logs. Should we finally do something ?

Markus Eisele 09/07/2012

[javaee-spec users] [jsr342-experts] Re: Logs. Should we finally do something ?

Werner Keil 09/07/2012

[javaee-spec users] [jsr342-experts] Re: Logs. Should we finally do something ?

Werner Keil 09/07/2012

[javaee-spec users] [jsr342-experts] Re: Logs. Should we finally do something ?

Antonio Goncalves 09/07/2012

[javaee-spec users] [jsr342-experts] Re: Logs. Should we finally do something ?

Werner Keil 09/07/2012

[javaee-spec users] [jsr342-experts] Re: Logs. Should we finally do something ?

Bill Shannon 09/07/2012

[javaee-spec users] Re: [jsr342-experts] Re: Logs. Should we finally do something ?

Laird Nelson 09/07/2012

[javaee-spec users] [jsr342-experts] Re: Logs. Should we finally do something ?

Werner Keil 09/07/2012

[javaee-spec users] [jsr342-experts] Re: Logs. Should we finally do something ?

Antonio Goncalves 09/09/2012

[javaee-spec users] [jsr342-experts] Re: Logs. Should we finally do something ?

Bill Shannon 09/10/2012

[javaee-spec users] [jsr342-experts] Re: Logs. Should we finally do something ?

Jevgeni Kabanov 09/10/2012

[javaee-spec users] [jsr342-experts] Re: Logs. Should we finally do something ?

Werner Keil 09/10/2012
 
 
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